Second report of Her Majesty's Commissioners for inquiring into the housing of the working classses : Scotland.

  • Great Britain. Royal Commission on Housing of the Working Classes.
Date:
1885
Catalogue details

Licence: Public Domain Mark

Credit: Second report of Her Majesty's Commissioners for inquiring into the housing of the working classses : Scotland. Source: Wellcome Collection.

Provider: This material has been provided by London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine Library & Archives Service. The original may be consulted at London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine Library & Archives Service.

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    Mr. W. D. Wodsivorth, Mr. J. H. Monahan, Q.C., Mr. F. X. F. Mac Cube, M.B.C.S.E., F.R.C.P.I., Mi: C. P. Cotton, M. Inst. C.E. 23 May 1885. 21.840. In Ireland they formerly applied to all urban sanitaiy districts containing, according to the last published census, a population of 25,000 and upwards ?—Yes; there has been an alteration made in that by the Labourers Act of 1883. 21.841. It is now 12,000?—It is now 12,000; and in addition to that there is a power in the 20th section of the Labourers Act, 1883, given to the Local Government Board, to extend them to other towns by provisional order. 21.842. So that the extension which we have re- commended for other parts of the United Kingdom is not necessary in Ireland ?—The power is given, sub- ject to a provisional order being made by the Local Government Board. They must be urban sanitary authorities. 21.843. How far have schemes been made under Sir Richard Cross' Acts ?—Orders have been settled for three towns,—Cork, Dublin, and Belfast. I am not aware that there are any others. Perhaps you will allow me to make a suggestion with regard to Mr. Torrens' Acts, in case it should be thought pro- per to make any amendment in them. I noticed that there was a proposal in the First Report of your Com- mission, to the effect that there should be an altera- tion made in the Act of 1868, with reference to the l»rovision in tlie 13th section enabling the Secretary of State to make an order binding the local authority. There is a suggestion that that section should be extended to Avhat are called obstructive buildings. In case any amendment should be made in that section, I would suggest that with reference to Ireland it would be a great convenience to substitute for the Secretary of State the Local Government Board in this country. 21.844. It would be, by analogy of other legisla- tion, the Local Government Board?—Yes; It is plainly, I should say, a mere slip in the drafting of the Act that there was not some provision for the case, but as I was asked about it I thought I might call your attention to it. 21.845. {To 3Ir. Cotton.) I wish to ask you some questions with reference to the Artizans' Dwellings Acts. The Act of 1875 was, as Mr. Monahan has just told us, limited in its application to urban sanitary districts containing, according to the last published census, a population of 25,000 and upwards; and there were only live urban sanitary districts in Ireland which came under this category, viz., Dublin, with 249,002 inhabitants; Belfast, with 208,122; Cork, with 80,124 ; Limerick, witii 38,562 ; and London- derry, with 29,162?—Yes, there are only five towns which come under that category. 21.846. Then, as Mr. Monahan has just told us, by the Labourers (Ireland) Act, 1883, the Act of 1875, as amended by subsequent Acts, was extended to all urban sanitary districts in Ireland which (1) contain, according to the last published census, a population of 12,000 and upwards; or (2) shall be authorised by a provisional order issued by the Local Government Board to put the Act in operation ?—That is so. 21.847. I suppose the Local Government Board would not be likely to refuse the provisional order?—• There were three applications ; one was withdrawn, but in the other two cases orders were issued. 21.848. The urban sanitary districts in Ireland which contain, accoi'ding to the census of 1881, a population of over 12,000 (besides the five wdiich have just been mentioned, containing over 25,000) are Droglieda, with 12,297 ; Galway, 15,471; Kilkenny, 12,291); Kingstown, 18,586; Newry, 14,808 ; Pem- broke, 23,222; l^iathmines and Rathgar, 24,370; Watcrford, 22,457; and Wexford, 12,163?—Yes. 21,819. None of these luban districts have yet availed themselves of the extension to them of the Act of lh7o. Sir Richard Cro.ss' Act ?—No. 21,850. The remaining urban sanitary districts to any of which the Act of 1875 may be extended by provisional order are 47 in number, I think ?— Yes. 21.851. And they include, for instance. New Ross, a small town with a high death-rate ?—Yes, 21.852. Provisional orders have been made and confirmed by Parliament in the cases of Thurles and and Trim, have they not ?—Yes, under the 20th section of the Labourers Act. 21.853. No further action has been taken in the case of Trim, I believe ?—Mr, Wodsworth tells me that those provisional orders have not yet been confirmed. 21.854. {To 31r. Wodsworth.) Was not the Thurles provisional order confirmed ?—I think neither of them has been confirmed. 21.855. {To Mr. Cotton.) In the case of Thurles, preliminary steps were taken by advertisements and notices in November 1884, I think?—Yes. 21.856. And they have a scheme for five areas, have they not ?—They had. 21.857. {To Mr. Wodsworth.) If the scheme has not been confirmed it is owing to non-compliance with the provisional oixler ?—It is simply because there has not been time. 21.858. To come back to the three towns in which Sir Richard Cross' Acts have been tried, Viz., Belfast, Cork, and Dublin, as to Dublin we shall have a great deal of evidence in the course of the present day ; in the case of Belfast a provisional order was confirmed by Parliament in 1877, I think ?—Yes. 21.859. And the scheme has been carried out under a loan of 12,000/. obtained from the Commissioners of Public Works in Ireland ?—Yes. 21.860. (To Mr. Cotton.) But that scheme was really very little more than a scheme for a new street, was it ?—What happened in the case of Belfast was this : There was an unhealthy area of one English acre cleared, and that was almost entirely converted into new streets; and an area of an acre and a half was purchased at a little distance oflT, and upon that artizans' dwellings have been built. 21.861. In the case of Dublin a provisional order confirming a scheme with regard to the Coombe area and the Boyne Street area was issued and confirmed by Parliament in 1877, I think ?—Yes. 21.862. An official representation Avas made as to eight unhealthy areas, and the corporation made a scheme as to two of them ?—Yes ; the Coombe area and the Boyne Street area. 21.863. The estimated cost of carrying out these two schemes was 20,000/., was it not ?—Yes. 21.864. Then when the Act was passed the Coombe area was taken in hand ?—It was. 21.865. The 20,000/. which was borrowed from the Commissioners of Public Works in Ireland Avas found to be only sufficient for purchasing the property iu and clearing the Coombe area ?—That Avas so. 21.866. And an additional loan of 4,000/. had to be granted for constx'ucting the new streets, sewering, lighting, and giving a water supply to this area ?— Yes. 21.867. When this was done, the area was let on perpetuity lease to the Artizans' Dwellings Com- pany at a rent of 200/. per annum, was it not?—It Avas. 21.868. The number of persons displaced on the Coombe area was, I think, 984 ?—Yes. 21.869. And the Artizans' Dwellings Comjiany haA-e erected 211 houses, in Avhich 1,000 persons are accommodated ?—Yes. 21.870. The scheme as regards the Boyne Street area has not yet been carried out, has it ?—No. Nearly all the houses in the Eoyne Street area, AA'cre depopu- lated under the Public Health Act. 21.871. That is to say, they Avere closed as being uufit for human habitation ?—Quite so. 21.872. The population on that area Avas 95, and it is now reduced to 37 ?—It is, 21.873. With regard to the Plunket Street area, a provisional order to enable the corporation to carry out a scheme for that area Avas issued and confirmed in 1880, i believe?—Yes. 21.874. And a loan of 15,000/. Avas granted for the